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In today's episode of the HR Leaders Podcast, we welcome Katya Laviolette, Chief People Officer at 1Password.

Katya shares insights into scaling a remote-first, high-growth company while preserving a unique, people-centered culture. She discusses the role of resilience, intentional onboarding practices, and the importance of transparency in hiring for a fully remote company.

🎓 In this episode, Katya discusses:

1. Why transparency during hiring creates long-term success.

2. The value of intentional onboarding in a remote-first company.

3. Balancing flexibility with employee accountability in remote work.

4. How to build a resilient culture that supports innovation and employee well-being.

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Katya Laviolette 0:00

We really talk about, like, keeping things simple, putting people first. These are, these are elements that are weaved into our culture. We talk about being nimble. We talk about being almost scrappy, but scaling quickly. And so it's okay to fail, to iterate and so forth, but please learn from it, and then let's get a better product out to market. And so these are elements that I think are very foundational to how the business was built.

Chris Rainey 0:41

Hey, catcher, welcome to the show. How are you?

Katya Laviolette 0:44

I'm good pleasure to be here, Chris. I

Chris Rainey 0:45

suppose that you can see you. You look very artistic today. I feel like you're I feel like you're about to paint me an amazing portrait. You know, I do? You give me that vibes?

Katya Laviolette 0:57

Yes, exactly. I'm like, Well, it's a, it's Tuesday, it's like, a couple days before Halloween. So I'm a, I'm a Scorpio, so I love this month. Yeah,

Chris Rainey 1:07

do you know I was in the US, and I didn't realize how big Halloween was. Like, it's like, we were in New Jersey doing an event at Merck, and then we went over to Miami, and I was like, wow. Like, people really go all out for Halloween compared to the UK. London's just not really a big Halloween place. But I feel like it's a bit of a shame, because I see the kids smiles and the faces and the houses full of lights. And I'm like, how much electricity are you paying this month for that? But it looks really cool to do that.

Katya Laviolette 1:36

I was walking my dog the other morning, and it's, it's dark now, you know, with the with the, obviously, the fall and the winter camp. Yeah, we, the people in our neighborhood, they really do decorate. And they have, like, the some of the houses have, you know, the cemeteries and the way and, and the dog is, like, barking at them at six in the morning. I'm like, it's not a rabbit. Yeah, dogs

Chris Rainey 1:56

don't like masks either. Anyone who's got a dog knows that. Just don't put a mask on near the dog. I don't know about yours, my dog did not appreciate people coming with masks to our door knocking. How are you? How are things personally? How are you

Katya Laviolette 2:13

personally, professionally? Things are good. It's a very busy time, both personally and professionally. The we wrap up our fiscal year. So we are having an intense year, but on the road a lot, but it's all like, kind of like a happy, good so that's excellent. I just looking forward to kind of winding down the calendar year and getting a bit of rest and recharge as we forge into 2025 Yeah.

Chris Rainey 2:37

I was speaking to a situation last weekend, saying to me, Chris, it's organized chaos. But you have to understand when you're in or you're out of sprints, if that makes sense, so like when they're in a sprint, as long as you know you're in a sprint, you can prepare for the workload, the long hours, the, you know, the amount of stress, but, but it's when you're you don't realize you're in a sprint, and it's like that that then things can kind of get a bit too much and overwhelming, if that makes sense,

Katya Laviolette 3:01

absolutely. And I would add to that, I think it's when you're in a sprint and you know that your work has impact and you're moving the needle, you'll keep engaged. But if you're working and you're spinning and it's not going anywhere, that's where it can be quite detrimental. So you

Chris Rainey 3:14

say a lot better than me. That's what I was trying to get across. But you, you will be like, Chris, I live it. So I can do that. Tell everyone a bit about, more about the company, because I know the company very well. You know, it's been a fascinating story journey. You know, I saw your was it Series C or D? I'm forgetting now, which was one of the biggest series C's ever in history, if I recall, on the news, talk to everyone a little bit about the business.

Katya Laviolette 3:39

Sure. So one password. We are a cyber security company, very much Canadian roots, founded by four founders, two couples just outside of the Toronto area about 18 plus years ago. Wow. So boot shop company, and as you probably knew it from the beginning, it was basically a consumer application, and they were trying to solve the problem of you having, like, all these post it notes, or you can buy those books. Could you put your passwords in, and I mean, major security issues? And they built an application on Apple, or Mac at the time, Mac platform, and then it just really took off over the years, from a consumer application on a number of platforms. And then about 2019 they decided to do their first round of funding. 2020 early 21 second round. And as you say, Series C, end of 21 largest fundraise in Canada at the time. And really shifted into B to B. So today we are a multi product identity security company. We really take care of people, keeping people safe. We are in five countries. We're tracking around 1400 employees and growing very, very rapidly. And really, we're there really well. How I kind of say it in layperson's terms, is remote work in the hybrid workplace of pre COVID, everyone's bringing their devices, personal, some work related. And so everything you bring into the workplace produces, I call it a gap. So you have like little bubbles in the funnel, and we're protecting all those little holes once you log in, because once you log in, that's where the hack, the hacks can happen. There's so many. Yeah, it's very, very important, both on, both on personal and professional. So B to B, B to C. Company high growth and and growing, and very global. I'll

Chris Rainey 5:39

tell you a funny story and only you probably in a few people appreciate it was that Merck doing our event at Merck Pharmaceuticals, HQ New Jersey last week, 60 CHROs and we had a panel where the CEO, Chief Technology Officer, CTO and chief diversity officer was sharing around how they're sort of using AI. And the relationship between CHRO CCO, you know, how they're getting AI embedded, etc, right? And I had recorded that session, and I had a hard drive, and they said, Oh, the only way we can get that hard drive is if we send it to, you know, our Google Cloud, and we can then send it to you. And I said, can I plug my hard drive into your computer? Imagine saying that to the chief technology officer. He was, No, you can't put your hard drive into my computer view. And then it clicked in my head. I was like, what like to your point? Like a perfect example of, if someone,

Katya Laviolette 6:31

I'm very glad they said that.

Chris Rainey 6:35

Perfect example of No, you can't plug your personal hard drive into our work computer. Chris and I was like, Oh, yes, that makes complete sense. But these are things, a lot of these things, people don't even realize they're doing, right? No, not at all.

Katya Laviolette 6:49

It's all natural and so, yeah, so our solution is to protect that, because you want to keep the ease of, you know, working with multiple, multiple apps and so forth, but you know, you have to find a way to protect so it is, it's, it's just grow at growing, growing

Chris Rainey 7:06

business. Yeah, well, so fast, growing business. Right now, what's top of mind for you, what you're most passionate about right now?

Katya Laviolette 7:14

I think, from our standpoint, or from my standpoint, on the people front, it's continuing to scale in a healthy, sustainable way. So there's this kind of longevity piece to the business. It's been around for 18 plus years. We want it to be around, obviously, much, much longer. And I think that you you do that while you grow in a very, a very prudent and resourceful way, and you take care of the people along the way. So I mean, people do talk about it, and maybe they roll their eyes and say, well, people are the foundational element. But, yeah, we have a phenomenal tech stack, but that tech stack is only as good as the people who are taking care of it and then, obviously taking care of the product and bringing it to market, and then supporting all the enterprises and consumers that we have out there. And so, you know, our foundation of people is a very important lever. It's also very cultural for us in terms of how the business was built. I alluded to the two couples who were our founders originally, or still are, but who actually built the business? And then we brought in our our CEO, Jeff shiner, and now we have our full C suite. And I think, you know, everyone has people at the heart of it, because we can't do what we're doing without the talent we have.

Chris Rainey 8:34

Yeah, how do you a big challenge? You know, many leaders I speak to in your position, faces and companies founders, how do you then maintain that culture and innovation that got you where you are as you grow?

Katya Laviolette 8:50

I think it's an evolution. I don't think you can say, Well, this was the culture in 2005 when the company was founded, and we just have to basically mirror it. I mean, things change. You know, look at the whole era of COVID. I think things pushed us dramatically to think differently. Look at AI, what's happening now. So I always say that the most important thing is taking those core pieces of the culture, and those are like non negotiables, and from there there's other things that evolve. And so what would they

Chris Rainey 9:18

be? What would some of the non negotiables be that these are fundamental to our success.

Katya Laviolette 9:25

We we really talk about, like, keeping things simple, putting people first. These are, these are elements that are weaved into our culture. We talk about being nimble. We talk about being almost scrappy, but scaling quickly. And so it's okay to fail, to iterate and so forth, but please learn from it, and then let's get a better product out to market. And so these are elements that I think are very foundational to. The business was built so continually thinking about innovation, iteration, being with the market. I mean, for us, just moving from consumer product to an enterprise product, and then a product that is foundational as a password manager, but then understanding how you live the evolution to enterprise, and that the enterprise needs a much more sophisticated product. It has different, different variables to it. I think these are all things that culturally leave themselves through in terms of that, that growth story. And so we're very, very proud of what we've built and but we're very open to feedback, open to change. But there's, there's like these fundamental elements, like being a remote first company. We're 18 years being remote, so that's quite unique. Wow. The company was founded as a remote company, so we're not one of those COVID stories of going remote and staying remote, and so all that weaves into the culture as kind of a do not touch those parts and honor those parts, and then be open to change from there. Yeah.

Chris Rainey 11:09

How do you do that in a practical sense, though, are you talking about this during the onboarding, the pre boarding? Are you kind of weaving it into the day to day? Like, how do you ensure that that shows up and is part of people's, you know, in the flow of work, as it were,

Katya Laviolette 11:24

the word I use a lot is intentional. And I was actually just talking to my team the other day, because I think we're very even just our onboarding is quite unique. When I started, they were like, okay, Katya, you start on a Wednesday. I'm like, Wednesday. Why would I start on a Wednesday? Like, normally you

Chris Rainey 11:41

just kind of true, like, default to Monday, right? Like, as tradition, just a calendar,

Katya Laviolette 11:45

and they're like, Oh no, no, no, no. This is a remote company. There's a lot to do. You're going to be overloaded, and by the the the types of tools and the information that you have, so we're going to give you kind of a three day full onboarding of what to expect from a tools, a culture, a people standpoint, and then you'll be able to take the weekend, digest it, and be ready to go. And so we have all obviously iterated as the time has gone on, our onboarding. But there are things that are very important. We have all still at 1400 employees. We have them all meet our founders. They are very passionate about the business, so they can understand, like, how

Chris Rainey 12:27

this just every single employee has met the founders,

Katya Laviolette 12:30

oh yes, and they're and they're regularly on all company, all hands with us as well. You know, I think those are things that are you talk about the cultural piece. Those are important things to honor and keep, what

Chris Rainey 12:43

some other things you do during the onboarding that is going, you know, to make successfully onboard remote employees that you would say, these are super important that people need to

Katya Laviolette 12:56

know. Well, we take them through kind of the norms and the cadence of how we work. So we have a whole, you know, you know, notion. We have a whole notion page about, you know, where to find all the information. We actually have one onboarding ambassador. We do have a backup, but he is really our ambassador. He's been with us for over a decade. He knows the company inside out, and so it's really the first individual that all employees really

Chris Rainey 13:19

have an onboarding ambassador, dedicated. Well,

Katya Laviolette 13:23

we don't this is my name for

Unknown Speaker 13:25

our voice, a good name.

Katya Laviolette 13:28

I do. I do call him. Him that because he does represent the past, the present and the future. And so I think that that's also very important. And so it's not like a sausage machine where we're turning things through. We do have our communication prior to someone starting, then when they're starting. And he kind of like weaves through the whole first few weeks. We do very, very structured checklists about what people need to know. And we just, we keep getting better at it, because it is a it's an evolution of what's changing, and the information is a lot as we scale. And so, yeah, we're just very, very intentional about what we need to tell people what we do, async, what we don't do, async, what we do, you know, face to face, because that's very, very important in a remote company. Yeah,

Chris Rainey 14:19

I love that. I remember years back, I was speaking to, I think it was a head of remote work for like GitHub, because they have kind of this famous case study, right? And he was there, and he was like, document everything I read as a first thing, the first thing he said to me, I was like, I don't think you're Sun King. Sunk in at the time when he said it to me. And I was like, and then, now, then we went, obviously for COVID. And I was like, oh, okay, I get it like you really have to have every This is how we work, the way we work, how we do work, how we measure work, literally everything laid out for people.

Katya Laviolette 14:51

They set the they really set the bar, actually, that they have a whole playbook, and

Chris Rainey 14:56

they gave it away, right? They phenomenal, open source. Yeah, yes, I have. I've looked here,

Katya Laviolette 15:03

you find that in the tech sector, which I think is phenomenal. I come from very, very varying industries, and I think what's unique about the tech space is that it is a community people share. You can learn from one another. It's fast paced, and I think that is, you know, even what we're doing in the diversity, equity, inclusion space, we share a lot with our community, because you can only get better by sharing. It's not, you know, I don't think it's IP, it's like, let's

Chris Rainey 15:28

it's not on us. It's not an us and them, right? It's a it's a we, exactly, yeah, it's important. We just had our global di summit a few weeks ago, and it was incredible. We had 1600 heads of Dei, chief diversity officers, come together. And it was just unreal to see everyone come together and share and just, you know, as I said, there was competitors. You know, you had, you know, people direct competitors, on the same panels, just sharing everything as well. It's so refreshing. It was amazing,

Katya Laviolette 16:00

yes, and it's an excellent topic for that, because you can only be as good as you are. You can't really. You should not be wearing blinders in that perspective. You really need to be open to what's going it

Chris Rainey 16:12

goes against everything. If you're in dei and that's your perspective, it kind of goes against the entire purpose. How is it being a chief people officer in a fully remote. What advice would you give to other Chief People officers thinking about going into a company that has a fully remote because it might, I don't know. Maybe you're saying it's completely sane, Chris. Or you know, how has that changed? Is this the first time you've worked in a fully remote company?

Katya Laviolette 16:35

Yes. I mean, in COVID prior to one password, I was at a company that obviously left the office one day and eventually started to return to work, but this was the first time I've worked in a fully intentional, remote company. And I think even before I talk about the advice for other CHROs, I was just chatting with my staff the other day. And you know, as you evolve, we refine, we get better at what we do, we have a full complement of talent acquisition, full team, and we do, obviously, quite heavy recruitment. And I keep saying, we need to be even more intentional about what it means to work here, because it is remote, and not everyone can adapt to that. And so I said, You need to give people. I call it in the olden days, it was called the realistic job Preview. I'm sure there's a fancier name now, but really tell them, hey, this is what's great about this company. This is what you might want to think about, because you need to really be informed. Come in. And so the importance of being direct, being factual and not beating around the bush about what it means. And so coming back to your question on just advice on the HR leader front, it's there's such there's a positive in terms of the flexibility, in terms of the pace and the innovation, because remote, I think, goes quite quickly. And I the reason I say that very tactically, is because your meetings are short. Like, yes, we have sometimes have these all day remote readings, which I think are sometimes very draining, but your meetings are actually relatively short compared to what you might have in office. So you have to think Lee, and then you have time to digest and so forth. But I think it's we have the best of both. We do not have offices, but we we do. We have a space of which we have built out of Toronto, which is really where, kind of the company was formed. And we got our collaboration space because we want to bring people together. And so when you have a blend of remote work, and then face to face for strategic and innovative, yeah, think it's not like I show up, I wipe my card to get a coffee, and I sit at my desk. And so if you're trying to do remote, well, it's a blend of that. It's a blend of that in person time, but

Chris Rainey 19:00

for but intentional. And like you said, intentional for collaboration, innovation, creative, yeah,

Katya Laviolette 19:06

and strategy, setting your budget, plan, OKRs and so forth. Now the other part is you need to mind yourself. I mean, I just came back from six days on the road, and when you work remotely, you have time to kind of do these mini recharges. And when you are in person, it is, it can be draining, because it's, it's a very long, yeah, always on. You know, you have your meetings, and then you have your evening activities and so forth. So I think that I say, even coming back to the talent acquisition piece, I say to to the recruitment team, please check, do people understand what it means to be remote, because if they, if they don't understand it, they won't be successful. I

Chris Rainey 19:46

love your honesty, by the way. I love that because it may seem counter intuitive, you know. And people, oh, we're losing out on talent, no, because they're, they're gonna leave anyway they are.

Katya Laviolette 19:56

And we were debating it the other day on because I think they found. Me very like, and I said, No, you need to tell them, like, what's like? Like, it's our responsibility. If you hire someone and you give them, like, a false view, and all these, we call it like a flower review of everything life is not like that. There's, like, some really interesting pieces, and then there's some hard pieces. And so I just want people to know what they're getting into. So if it's not working, then I can actually very safely say, you know, I gave you the realistic job preview. So I think that's important.

Chris Rainey 20:34

I think that makes you more attractive to those people, because how often would they go into a meeting with a hiring manager or recruiter who says this is the reality, and this may not be for you, because that just builds even more trust, because that person's being that, wow, here's this company being so transparent with me and an open and being honest. That's the kind of company I want to work for. So I feel like it kind of it will make people feel, you know, some recruiters might be like, Oh, that's I'm gonna lose this candidate I've been working really hard on. But, I mean, in reality, yes, you're actually building more trust and

Katya Laviolette 21:05

managers who are nervous because they're looking for talent. And yeah, I say, I'm saying you need to take you need to be very realistic, because if you do a hire that doesn't work for you, mutually or either way, you're you're kind of actually losing time as well from a business perspective. And so that intentionality, I think, is very critical. One best practice that I do with all my own personal hiring is obviously we go through the recruitment process, and when we get down to kind of finalists, I have a very, very realistic discussion about we're going to make you an offer, you need to know what you're getting into and be very clear, and then it actually puts the the onus back on them to think about, is this the right place for me? I

Chris Rainey 21:48

honestly love that so much because, like, there's companies, even I've joined in the past that have given me the dream, sold me the dream, right? We've all had it. You go in,

Katya Laviolette 21:56

there's no there's no dream in life.

Chris Rainey 21:59

But yeah, setting expectations of what this is and isn't is, is because they're going to find out. I said they're going to find out anyway, whether it's them the hard way on the job, they're going to find there's a thing called Social Media exists, there's glass door, there's all these things, right? That happens as well, but that's the last thing you want to do because, and it's

Katya Laviolette 22:18

your job to turn that dream into a dream, because that's your you know, as an employer or someone being hired, I think it's incumbent on understanding what you're getting into and then turning that into a positive that is is rewarding for yourself. Yeah,

Chris Rainey 22:32

what message would you give to all of those companies right now that are reverting completely back to in office, we're seeing this huge wave like, you know, there was like a mini wave in the beginning of the year with, sort of the Facebooks and the others that all could sort of wait. And now every day I'm hearing another another very large organization, saying it's not working, even though the data doesn't say that we're going straight back into the office. What message would you give to them?

Katya Laviolette 22:59

Well, I like you. I just saw a survey on LinkedIn the other day. I don't know the statistical relevance of it, but it was something like the headliner or headline was, 93% of CEOs expect full full F, U, L, L, return to work in the next two years. And I think that life is different. I think I'm not against obviously, hybrid work, remote work is particular for the industries. If you're working in manufacturing and you're beside, you're beside a plant, and you need to be there for the product, that's really important. But I think that the flexibility is very attractive, and so I think you can do the mix of both. And it's also about treating your employees like adults. And again, it comes back to that intentionality. If I was at the beginning of the hiring process and I was responsible for a function, or, sorry, an HR function in a company that was hybrid, I would be very clear on what my expectations are at the beginning with that candidate. So there's just no false understanding, yeah, and I, I think we are, you know, painting a brush broadly. That is probably in the supply and demand for talent right now, okay to do, because the market has shifted. We're not in 2022 where it's tight, tight. I

Chris Rainey 24:18

was gonna ask you now, what would you think impacts going to be, because before, in that market, you previously just said it'd be like you're going to lose a lot of talent. But what do you

Katya Laviolette 24:26

think now? Well, now you've got this shift, and I say it a lot. You know, we had something like 200,000 resumes that came, came to us in 2020, 23 and we're tracking that a bit higher than that this year, and so we have a lot of a lot of talent pool, but it can quickly change. And so you're making those commitments now, and so you're kind of rid the companies are being very rigid in their structure, and they're not, they're not flexible enough to pivot, and that can actually, long term, be difficult for the business. Yeah. What

Chris Rainey 24:59

do you. Things driving it,

Katya Laviolette 25:02

um, I think there's some personal experiences people have. We all bring personal experience. We all being biased to the workplace. I was just on a call, actually, the other day. I also do some board work as well. It's, you know, where I want to land in my my future career. And I'm on a relatively large company from a board perspective, and I was talking to the CEO, and we were talking about, you know, a very, very senior search for a role, and how we would put a committee together, and one of the individuals on the committee, we would like, them, obviously, to be part of the interview process. And the answer was, well, this person is, is remote, like we need them to meet in person. I said, I think we can do both. We can set it up to be successful and not have to, you know, fly in the individual for, I don't know, a couple 1000, $3,000 with all the expenses. And I think that we can set up an interview process that is hybrid, yeah, and so we have to challenge that, that that notion, because we were doing it for a few years in COVID, I think it probably went to the extreme from an engagement and productivity perspective, where we lost some and now I think you can actually have the best of

Chris Rainey 26:16

both. Yeah, like you said earlier, right in the DI when everyone brings their backpack of beliefs with them as well. And it's easy to revert back to what was comfortable if you've been doing something for 2030, years, the same way it's very difficult. I told a story like I was just before the pandemic. I was chatting to a teacher. I was just like, we've got this plan over the next 10 years to move 5000 of our call center reps remotely, right? 10 year plan, right? Happened in like two weeks, so we and we had a call a few weeks later because of the pandemic, right, right? So we had, yeah, we had a call after and was both just laughing, saying, We just did a podcast where you said you got this plan and it couldn't be done. And she was like, it's done. Literally, it was done.

Katya Laviolette 27:07

Yes, those are some of the positives. Is you just, you just accelerated things, yeah, and then, and then, now you can go back and you can just think about, okay, what are the tweaks and adjustments we might need to make to make it even better? Yeah,

Chris Rainey 27:21

before I let you go, what would you say is your parting piece of advice for those HR leaders of tomorrow, because the role has changed so much. You know, I've been doing this for 20 years, seven, since I was 1737, now, just really, just crazy that I just realized I'm doing it for 20

Katya Laviolette 27:41

years, two decades. We should say decades. It seems that

Chris Rainey 27:45

sound better. All right, okay, I'll change the two decades. Yeah. I was like, wow, I've, like, feel really old right now, and I'm doing and it's almost, like, almost unrecognizable from when I started, to where we are now. What advice would you give to those leaders that are going to be sitting in the CPO role one day?

Katya Laviolette 28:00

I think it was some I was talking to. I've talked about this quite a bit, about the whole concept of resilience and and how I think that the profession has fundamentally changed over the last, I'd say, four to five years, and you have to choose if you want to be in this profession, and if it motivates you, because it can be very challenging. So my advice is, you need to use resilience in a way that is motivational for you. You will go through some very, very challenging times. But just like you were saying at the beginning, is, you know, you might be very, very busy and on these sprints. But if you're making impact and you're influencing, that shows a level of resilience and also a level of engagement. And so resilience influence directful, being very direct and factual and being really clear about what the expectations are. You know, I think are elements that are really, really critical for the role. It's not like you just work in this box and you do programs and policies and so forth, like the role is the role has this cascade effect throughout the business, and I think it's essential. So those three areas, I think would be very, very important to focus on very soft, but also at the same time, very important to develop as a leader, not just HR leaders in general, 100%

Chris Rainey 29:33

on very quickly on that resilience piece. How do you find that balance between that and looking after your own personal well being.

Katya Laviolette 29:42

I think it is very, very independent to every individual. And I think that the way you might take care of yourself is different than me. There is no vanilla bread and butter or peanut butter approach. And I think that. People need to dig deep into themselves and say, What? What relaxes me? What takes my mind off work, what really grounds me? And you know, yoga might be one for just an extreme example, yoga might be one for some someone. And then, I don't know, running and running an Iron Man might be something for someone else. And so it's you have to find what is good for you. And so what we try and do in, you know, I think when we were first kind of on this journey, on on mental health and balance, it was always like, just do this. I'm like, No, I think these are all elements, and you yourself have to decide what is best and and I think it takes time. And like, you know, five years ago, it was different, and today it's a different it's a different combination form,

Chris Rainey 30:43

yeah, so you're doing yoga and marathons. Is

Katya Laviolette 30:48

that what you're saying? No, I started to do a lot of running back, oh, nice. Up until, up until, actually, the beginning of the year, and now I've actually flipped, and now I'm just a peloton. Oh,

Chris Rainey 31:01

you're one of those. Shane, my co founder, is one of those. You're like, he's like, a cult.

Katya Laviolette 31:07

It's very inspirational. The instructors are just like, they're, I should say,

Chris Rainey 31:13

tribe. Cult sounds a bit extreme. Your tribe, yeah,

Katya Laviolette 31:18

it's like, you need to find what's best for you is kind of the conclusion, no, I

Chris Rainey 31:22

agree. Like for me, I used to, I had a tough couple of years. You know, the pandemic was tough. I suffered from anxiety attacks, and kind of was very overwhelmed, and I didn't know what to do. And for me, it could be as simple as just playing some computer games and just escaping from the world for a second, right? Good. Netflix, yeah. Like, you know, it doesn't have to be too, you know, too extreme. Or, you know, I just took some time after the Merc event to spend some time my wife in Miami, and we had no plans. Well, that's nice. So we just went there, and we were like, what do we do? Like, we had nothing planned for the entire week, and then we made that we that, you know, sort of Yeah, and we intentionally didn't plan anything so we could just discover what we're going to do and just let flow where. And that was it. That was enough for me to kind of re energize to your point, after two days in person, which was quite exhausting. So back to your point. I hadn't been in in in person environment for two solid days, all day, every day, and I was like, Whoa, kind of feeling a little bit exhausted after that. So, but listen, I appreciate you coming on the show and sharing your story, and congratulations to you and the team I followed the story and the journey. Shane, my co founder, was like, oh, isn't that company that had a really big race series? And I was like, Yes, how it's crazy. Even we kind of know that. And I've been a user of the product in the earlier days as a personal personally as well. And I had no idea that you were fully remote, by the way, this entire time. So that's that's incredible what you and the founders have achieved. So I appreciate you coming on the show, and I wish you all the best until we next week. Oh, thank

Katya Laviolette 33:03

you. Thank you, Chris. It's been a pleasure being on the show and getting to know you personally. And yeah, take good care. I'll be I'll be following you.

Chris Rainey 33:11

Thanks. You.

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