Why Continuous Learning Is the Only Way to Stay Relevant in 2026
In this episode of the HR Leaders Podcast, we sit down with Frederic Patitucci, Chief People & Culture Officer at Philip Morris International, to unpack how one of the world’s largest organizations is transforming both its business model and its workforce capabilities at the same time.
Frederic explains how PMI’s bold shift toward a smoke-free future forced the company to rethink its operating model, moving from a single-product cigarette business to a complex multi-category innovation company spanning consumer technology, healthcare, and new consumer experiences.
He shares how this transformation required new skills, new operating structures, and a completely redefined company culture, including codifying the PMI DNA and embedding it directly into hiring, performance management, leadership development, and everyday decision-making.
Most importantly, Frederic reveals why the future of HR lies in managing skills instead of jobs, preparing employees for the skills that are rising, and helping people avoid career dead ends before disruption makes those roles obsolete.
🎓 In this episode, Frederic discusses:
Why managing skills is becoming more important than managing jobs
How organizations can prepare employees for future skills before disruption hits
Why culture had to be codified to integrate thousands of new leaders joining the organization
How PMI embedded its cultural values directly into hiring, performance, and leadership systems
How PMI is transforming from a traditional cigarette company into a smoke-free innovation company
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00:00
Today we have 83,000 people in the company and if you ask them what are the critical skills that you need today and tomorrow, it may be a bit challenging for them to get an answer. So what I asked the team to do is to map the skills of 83,000 people and we were coming from 15,000 jobs, which is far too many obviously, and we nailed that down to 2,000.
00:28
This document is already obsolete. The day it was produced, it was obsolete. So what we are trying to do is to have it online and line managers will be able to bring the skills that I see needed to make the business plan a reality. That will be the first way we will get this tool evolving, always up to date. And we will see over time the skills that are sun setting, the ones that are sun rising.
00:55
But we're going to go as well outside to benchmark ourselves with companies of similar size to make sure that we give a heads up to our employees. Watch out here, you are heading to a dead end. These skills will be gone in five next years. Make sure that you start getting upskill for what you like and what the company can provide you.
01:31
Fred, welcome to the show, my friend. How are you?
01:33
I'm very good. What about you, Chris? Good. I feel like you win the award for the best setup so far of the show with the video and audio. So congrats to the team.
01:42
Appreciate that. Thank you very much. Yeah. How's life treating you? Pretty good. A bit busy until the Christmas break, but busy for good thing, hopefully. So I'm pretty confident we're going to end the year in good shape. All good. It's always strange because when you come out of summer, like the end of the year just comes so quickly.
02:03
Indeed. Unbelievable. Yeah. I feel like I didn't have a break during that time. I understand what you mean. Yeah. Yeah. Before we jump in, tell everyone a little bit more about you personally, sort of your background and your journey to where we are today. Sure.
02:20
Again, thank you very much for having me on the on the broadcast. My name is Fred Battiglucci, head of PNC for Philip Morris International. I've been working a few years in the company, precisely December 1st is going to be my 34th year in the company.
02:38
And I joined what we used to call back then Altria, which was the motherhood with different business units, Kraft, SAV, and I'm a Kraft guy originally. I joined Altria through Kraft France for five years, and then, by chance, I moved to Philemon International, Romania, for Greenfield.
02:59
I stayed there for three years. Then from Romania, I moved to Switzerland in charge of the market, HR market.
03:06
and R&D back then. And then I took over HR operations worldwide, giving me the opportunity to understand the global footprint of PMR in terms of leaf manufacturing supply chain.
03:18
And after two years, I was blessed to get the job of head of HR for Eastern Europe, Africa, Middle East. And along the way, I took over China and Duty Free.
03:29
And then in 2011, we were facing some headwinds in Russia to set up the operating model. Russia was back then very centralized, and the idea was to have different consumer journeys. And I went to Russia for five years to shape up the organization, which for an HR guy is certainly the ultimate grail of what he can do in terms of impact.
03:49
And then when we kicked off the smoke-free vision, I was asked to come back to Lausanne to set up SFP, smoke-free product, from scratch.
03:58
And I stayed almost six years in my role.
04:03
And between you and I, I was planning to enjoy retirement almost three years ago. And I got the call from the chairman and CEO. He's your new mission, head of HR for PMI and a blessing for me. Yeah. Well, just so you know, between you and I has now been shared with 700,000 people. Indeed.
04:23
It's good. And then on the private side, I'm married.
04:28
I have six kids, three from a first marriage, and then I have a second bunch, if I call them, that are 10, 11, and 13.
04:40
Amazing. I've only got one seven-year-old daughter, so I'm going to be calling you for advice. Anytime I can open a business to give some advice to parents.
04:50
The problem is whenever you get advice from other parents, it never applies to your own children. Definitely. It speaks to me. It's always unique.
05:01
Going back a second, when you first went into that HR role, what was your impression of the function before going in versus now?
05:11
Yeah, I started my life in HR not yesterday. And when I look at what it was, almost 35 years ago, and today, HR was what we used to call a support function.
05:25
Very admin driven, process driven. And having an HR guy or lady having a bit of business background was almost weird. Yeah. Today, running HR for a multinational company like us, not understanding the commercial value chain end-to-end from upstream to downstream is weird, so you better understand the context.
05:47
At times, we still, and when I'm meeting my peers from other multinational companies, trying to define what is the role of HR, are we support function, enabling function?
05:57
At the end, frankly speaking, it doesn't matter. We are here to make an impact, indirect impact, because we are not a line manager. We are not true business managing directors or category heads.
06:08
But the moment you understand what the company is about in the business plan, then it gives you the freedom to bring the people agenda in a much natural way to fit what the business is after and not doing HR for HR. So yeah, in my last three or four decades,
06:26
I've seen the shift from HR for HR to HR for the business, and it feels really good. Yeah. I mean, when I started, I started at 17, so I've been doing this for 20 years and we won't get we won't get into the story about how that happened. Otherwise, we'll be here for a while. as well and all the listeners will be bored because they've heard the story many times but it's almost unrecognizable to see the transformation of the function from very much let's just say order takers to strategic business partners and I don't even like the word business partners actually because you don't even you don't hear that in any other function you don't see marketing business partners they are just part of the business as well
07:10
But let's get into it a bit more. You mentioned the smoke-free future. That's part of PMI's transformation towards a smoke-free future. It's quite a bold one.
07:21
Why is the PMI DNA so critical to this journey? And for you and the team, how are you aligning this with your people and making sure that you connect it with such a powerful purpose? yeah thanks chris for the question before i get there let me give you a bit of background or context for those who don't know so philip moore's international has been a traditional cigarette business for decades and then in 2016 we decided to go for this small free vision small free future
07:58
saying to the whole world that PMI will get out of the cigarette business over time. We will stop selling cigarettes over time.
08:07
So we entered then into what we call transformation, though this word today is not relevant anymore because we have transformed to a great extent. And while we were coming from a mono category called cigarettes with a very straight and lean operating model,
08:27
we had to change the business model from one category to multi-categories and by doing so we had to change the way the job get got done in the company what we call the operating model we were very vertically driven while selling only cigarettes we became much more horizontal in the way we deliver the value to the consumers We put together what we call project-based organizations, trying to shift from a job deliverable to a project or program deliverable.
09:00
We did some acquisition along the way, the most important one being through DishMatch. And then we entered as well in what we call beyond nicotine spaces, consumer health care, well-being, wellness, sorry. And all of that was rather disruptive.
09:19
And because we were not ready back then to enter into the B2C space, for example, there was no skills because we used to be exclusively B2B. We had to acquire skills from outside on B2B, on call centers, on digital paid media, on media.
09:36
And by having roughly 35% of our managers and above coming to the company, we realized that the integration of the newbies and the old-timers like me was suboptimal. In a nutshell, we were losing the company culture, and we didn't take time to define what is the new company culture in the context of a smoke-free product.
10:01
So, three years ago when I took over, I realized that there was a need to codify what the company values stand for.
10:10
And while I triggered that reflection, it was done with 300, 400 people that we brought from all over the world and trying to understand, but tell us beyond the data that we got from both surveys and analytics, tell us what in your mind the company value stands for.
10:32
And then after a few months, it was rather quick. We came with these three tagline.
10:37
We are better together. We care. and we are game changers.
10:43
And all of that got validated by these people. So co-creation with 300 people coming from different backgrounds, ethnicities, religion, gender, seniority, tenure.
10:56
And for each of these values, we put three observable behaviors. And all of these values and behaviors got integrated into the employee life cycle from pre-hiring to retiring.
11:11
And then once that was done, we started a big engagement in the company that became almost a grassroots movement. So we kicked that off in February 2023 with the CEO, Yasser Kolchak. And then in the next five to six months, we ended up with 280 events all over the world, touching roughly 83,000 people.
11:37
and showcasing what good looks like in terms of values in the company, what I call the license to operate, what I call the rules of the house.
11:46
And we mentioned as well what bad looks like. So we put together what we call this employee relation framework to define this is the line that you cannot cross.
11:57
And if you do so, no matter where you are and who you are in the rank in the organizations, you're going to be exposed to potential troubles.
12:06
And that went super well. It was really, as I said, a movement across the company. And there is no one single business meeting that I'm in where we don't mention these three values. So that became a bit of a...
12:19
in the organization that from the CEO office till the lowest level in the organization, we are carrying day in, day out, okay? So that was something that was extremely well received because there was a bit of vacuum because again, people like me that have been 30 years in the company, there was no need to codify the values, but for 35% of managers and above, they were telling me, but what the heck this is all about? And actually the idea to codify the values came from a session I was having, as of today, every other two weeks with newcomers. So I kicked that off in 2021, I guess, and yesterday or the day before I was with them.
13:02
And I was trying to explain with my own words and filter
13:07
what the company values stand for. And every time I was ending up the session, people were telling me, but where can we read what you're talking about? Where is it? I was telling them nowhere. And that's how the idea came to mind to codify the company culture.
13:22
So that was a good moment for the company. We didn't stop there, but I guess we will go back to that later on. It's so interesting we're having this conversation today because yesterday I had a group of 50 chief people officers for a workshop and it was around purpose, about leading with purpose and how do you connect your purpose with the business, your personal purpose with the business. And one of the insights that came from the discussions that in most organizations, the higher you go in the business, the more clear that is, you know, in terms of articulating the purpose and connecting their purpose to the organization. The lower you go down, it gets very clear, you know, in the factories, do I know what my role is in the bigger vision? of the organization. So the fact that the fact that you're now embedding those principles early into the employee lifecycle from day one is so important so they can connect their personal purpose with the organizational purpose.
14:21
Correct. That's great. So it's great to hear that you're already doing that.
14:25
Yeah. You know, at the end, when we, if I can elaborate on what you were saying, leading with internal purpose,
14:32
The purpose is twofold in the company. You have the what, which is to liberate the world from one of the biggest societal concerns, which is cigarettes. Okay.
14:43
Related to health, obviously, and that is very clear. This is obsessive for all of us in the company that the sooner we leave the second business, the better. We have obviously a few challenges on the regulatory side in some countries, but we're going to get there. We are today present in 100 countries with our smoke-free alternatives. So the Watt is bringing this first purpose or intent.
15:06
But equally important, the second one is how we're going to get there. And the second purpose is what we call the PMI DNA. You cannot go far if you don't have a set of values that are common across the board. And we call about the PMI DNA as the company culture, bearing in mind that we have as many cultures as markets where we operate, roughly 150.
15:30
But all of that is being bundled through the PMI DNA. And the PMI DNA are not corporate values. They are values that you, Chris, can use with your family or me, with mine, with my neighbor. And that's why this PMI DNA is so strong. It was everything but corporate values. Very authentic, very true, very real. So that was co-creation with our employees.
15:53
And that's important because that also came up in a conversation yesterday where some companies have a very, you know, they have a mission statement that isn't really connected to people's values and purpose. Like it's kind of very, you know, vague.
16:09
in terms of that. But the fact that you co-created these with the organization and I think the most important part is that they're not just, you know, they're not just principles. You're embedding that in processes in the business so it comes to life. Can you share some examples of how that shows up and how you've shaped your processes and work itself through these principles? Yeah, well, for example, if you take hiring,
16:40
Half joking, anytime I met an exec, I tell him or I tell her, if there is one thing I cannot really master is how we hire people.
16:49
But let me tell you what the interview will be all about. First of all, it will not be interview. It's going to be a bit like speed dating. You're going to tell me who you are. I'm going to tell you who we are. and if there are commonalities around the values we have a deal if not it doesn't mean that you are not great but it doesn't fit the company culture so the hiring process today we look obviously at the background at the universities or business schools people are coming from obviously but what is super and hyper important is the match between who people are from outside and who we are okay
17:24
When we do performance management, we have a component of the URAN achievement based on the what and another part based on the how people display the three values. So if you do great on the what, but you didn't display values as expected, you got to hit on your payout, for example. So you tied this to compensation.
17:47
Come again? So you have tied this to compensate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is so very difficult to have always equal rating on what and how, especially the how is more difficult to assess. But if people are below the expectation, they got the hits the same way.
18:07
They got the heat when they don't display the right behaviors back to what I was talking about on the employee relation framework. We have coaching session. We have verbal warning, written warning up to termination. And we are tracking that very carefully just to make sure that people understand that this is not a nice to have.
18:25
It is a business imperative. When you go to talent management, the same way on the C-suite, and we were having the CEO talent review with Yasek Olchak two months ago.
18:37
not only we look at what people have delivered not only we look at the runway high potential of our people but we look at the way they display the values and that's something that is of critical importance to the extent that regularly when i go to the boards to the company leadership committee, I have to report how we are doing in terms of company values. And that's something that is becoming a business imperative. Again, it's not in any case, it's not an HR staff. It's a company. It's a company matter. Yeah, exactly. i i can imagine going through this transformation obviously a big part of this is then really supporting your leaders and managers throughout the organization because they have they have the biggest impact right on on the business what kind of support or training did you do with them to help because this is a very different you know way of leading than you traditionally had in the past
19:37
Yeah, indeed. So what we started was to ensure that there is a strong understanding from the 1500 leaders that we have across the world, many presidents, vice presidents of the C-suite, the execs plus directors.
19:52
So we brought 1500 liters in different places of the world. Last year was Dubai, Hong Kong, Miami, Barcelona, and then Lausanne. So we did a full session trying to understand them to understand the why we are coming with that, trying to make things as tangible as possible.
20:15
And then from then on, we did the cascading through all the world of PMI, 130 markets. So that was highly penetrated.
20:24
And when we are having the portfolio of training on our curriculum, every training in the company relates to PMI DNA. So there is no one single, including functional training, where you don't refer to the values. So when we discuss hiring, development, promotion, awards, we have obviously awards based on the value that people display or not.
20:51
so that is becoming a muscle that we start uh we start mastering now the journey will never be over we're gonna have newcomers roughly the company welcome every year between eight to nine thousand newcomers so on the onboarding we have as well this uh focus on the on the company values
21:09
And you need to keep the light on. It's not a one-off. The journey will take forever. Because if we stop, well, human nature being what it is at times, you can forget where we have gone through. So that's something that will remain. Now, maybe to complement what I'm talking about in terms of PMI DNA, PMI DNA was chapter one of a longer journey.
21:34
Because when we were again, and that was my learning because I was in the company for many years on combustible business, without offending my colleagues in the combustible business, it's a rather simple operating model. The critical factor is your excise taxes. And when you have your excise taxes well fixed for the year, you know where you should end up in terms of
22:00
So back then, the needs to learn was there. If you were really curious, otherwise, no big deal.
22:09
In the multi-category where we are today, where you have hindled burn solution, nicotine purchase solution, evap solution, and entering in beyond nicotine with consumer healthcare, cannabinoids, or other product that will stimulate your mood, your sleep,
22:26
the business model becomes much more complex. So if we don't trigger these natural appetites so that people stay up to date, I mean relevant versus obsolete, we may end up in a big problem by having a workforce that will not be upskilled or will not have the appetite to get reskilled. So this year, as we did last year with PMI DNA,
22:53
We had a second round of worldwide events, four regions.
22:58
This year was Kuala Lumpur, Dubai, Rome, and Mexico, to explain what is behind the growth. Growth is an emanation of PMI DNA.
23:10
It's an emanation of PMI DNA. And the growth event, with the same cascading throughout the world, 83,000 people, was done in the purpose of chapter three. that will be next year growth through AI.
23:27
Because AI has been something that came into company like many other FMCGs or other multinationals two or three years ago. We have been working a lot on use cases, a few hundred use cases, but time has come to put the use cases a bit down and to start scaling up.
23:48
But when you scale up AI solution,
23:51
be it on the call centers, chatbots on call centers, or brand content, or even HR processes, we don't know yet, to be very frank with you, and I'm sure you will agree with me, what will be the impact on the skills of the future. No one does.
24:08
No one does. But back to what we went through 10 years ago when I was there at the get-go, where we weren't ready to embrace the new world of PMI multi-category, We just need to make sure that everybody exercise the muscle of learning, relearning, unlearning, so that the moment we know exactly what skills will be available, we can easily go and acquire skills. Skills is something that you can consume when they have been well defined. But the mindset to unlearn, to better learn, takes time.
24:40
Especially in an industry, cigarette business, that was relatively simple in terms of operating model. At the end, cigarette business was mainly marketing for marketing and pricing. Today, you have a complexity of the business on the life sciences, on product development, on sensory experience, on flavor, on taste, on the B2C, B2B, B2B2C.
25:06
So you better be ready today. You're going to have a big impact. So I don't think it's going to be a big impact on AI. It will be an evolution, a natural evolution, and it will help us to get time to have our people being riskier along the way.
25:20
Though two years ago, when I started the journey, I was wondering myself, but will it be a big impact? And I got help from some people in the company telling me, I don't think it's going to be a big impact. It's going to be an impact over time, but the big bang in my mind will not happen. And that gives us time to be ready. OK, we'll take two or three years and we start deploying solutions in the market that help us. What is the impact on the workforce? On those skills, suddenly there will be and they are already coming in.
25:48
on the headcount itself, so far we don't see much impact.
25:53
Yeah. Okay. So that's where we are today. A bit high level on the AI journey. Yeah, there's a lot to cover there.
26:00
So I was thinking as you were saying that is and I agree firstly about is much tougher to unlearn than it is to learn something. But with the different products and categories you're describing and the speed of change, you need to focus on upskilling and reskilling. So you have that time to market advantage. And you can't do that unless you have focus on time to proficiency.
26:25
And how do we shorten that as well? And the half life of skills, we've seen all of the data that's out there, right? If we don't start now, I was speaking to a VP of people analytics recently and it's like, Chris, we just finished after a year building our skills taxonomy and it's all out of date.
26:47
Because it's moving so quickly to be able to do that as well, right? And I know you mentioned your physical events that you've been done all over the world, which are amazing to bring people together. But how are you ensuring that learning is connected to work itself and shows up in the flow of work as opposed to being learning something you have to go to? It should come to me when I need it, right? Yeah. Well, Back to what you just said about mapping the skills.
27:22
Today, we have 83,000 people in the company. And if you ask them, what are the critical skills that you need today and tomorrow?
27:32
it may be a bit challenging for them to get an answer. So what I asked the team to do in the context of impact of the workforce over time is to map the skills of 83,000 people.
27:49
We started the journey four years ago, got a standstill, reactivated that last year, and we were coming from 15,000 jobs, which is far too many, obviously. And we nailed that down to 2,000. So today we have, for lack of a better word, a job family classification for 2,000 jobs.
28:15
And for each of the jobs, these jobs we know precisely today, What are the skills?
28:20
Now, this document is already obsolete. The day it was produced, it was obsolete. So what we are trying to do is to have it online.
28:31
And line managers, as of Feb next year, will be able to bring the skills that I see needed to make the business plan a reality. That will be the first way we will get this tool evolving, always up to date.
28:48
And we will see over time the skills that are sun setting, the ones that are sun rising.
28:53
But we're going to go as well outside to benchmark ourselves with companies of similar size and businesses on technology and innovation to make sure that we give a heads up to our employees. Watch out here. You are heading to a dead end. These skills will be gone in five next years.
29:12
Make sure that you start getting upskill for what you like and what the company can provide you. Yeah. that's still a vision, but at least the baseline has been set up and the baseline will be evolving over time. So that's where we are with today. So at least people know exactly what I need to do or learn to deliver my job and it makes me ready for the future. Yeah. And I think you, one of, so I recently interviewed Nicole Lamoureux, she's the chief people officer of IBM. And one of the things that we spoke about is they, IBM posts every year to the whole organization, these are the skills,
29:47
that we're looking for and these are the skills we feel like are declining. And it's super transparent about that, right? And of course, they provide the capability and tools for people to upskill, reskill, etc. But what they've also done, which was very somewhat controversial, is regardless of your seniority in the organization,
30:10
how you're, or how long you've been there, how you're compensated directly links to those skills that they're looking for. So it doesn't matter whether you've been there for 10 years or I've been there for two years. If you can demonstrate that you have this skill and these capabilities, you will be compensated X over here, which was quite, you know, it was, and I just thought that was fascinating. The level of transparency there. What were your thoughts? Yeah, yeah. Well, actually back to what IBM told you, the CHO told you, we are getting there as well because if you don't go the full blast or the full speed or the full way, you are hiding somehow something. And since we are promoting transparency and equity for each of the skills wrapped up around job families, we have the great level of the skills.
31:05
So people know exactly what I aspire to become head of HR. I know what is the grading of the job for the skill. So we are managing actually what we call the bank of skills. We are trying to move away from managing jobs to managing skills. Yeah, I love that.
31:22
And that has a price tag. 100%.
31:24
I think it's really empowering as an employee to know that I can take charge of my career and know that very transparently, this is what I need to do. And in order to get there, here's the support system in place to be able to do that. Whereas in the past, when I first started, you were kind of just waiting for a tap on the shoulder for a promotion.
31:46
after you've been there for a few years, right? And you weren't really in control or you're like, when's my manager going to retire to get the next job? But this is really exciting. And as we become more skills-based organizations, we need that in order to be agile and move quickly and move from role-based to project-based, right, as well, especially in a fast-paced organization with so many products that you're launching and markets that you're serving. You can't operate in the traditional model. It doesn't work, right?
32:17
I know we're near time, but I wanted to ask you, you know, what are some of the lessons that you've learned? I know obviously it's quite a broad question as a chief people officer that you know now that you wish you knew earlier.
32:35
in your career, for those people that are listening, for those aspiring chief people and culture officers, what do you know now that you wish you knew before? Well, you call that experience or wisdom or maybe a bit of both.
32:54
I think that when you have beliefs and convictions and when you understand the context under which you're operating,
33:05
that gives you the wings and the stamina to go bold and far
33:13
and to think big okay so at the end that's what i'm saying to many newcomers you will shape the job as you wish it has to be not the other way around forget the job spec the job spec will frame you too much have a look at it put in a drawer but then when you understand the value chain that you are part of shape the job as you think it should be so this notion of thinking being and bold for me is super important and uh and again back to what i call beliefs and convictions which at some can be difficult to deal with in a big corporation
33:52
It gives you this notion of, I don't feel inhibited. I like using often this word of inhibited, because when you are inhibited, you cannot make the impact, especially in HR, where we have an indirect influence. And what businesses want to hear, especially working day and night with the CEO, is that
34:14
We come with plans that are business plan related, but with an HR lens versus coming with an HR plan with a bit of those or notion of business. And that requires learning agility, that requires curiosity, that requires for sure always being on your toes, don't rest on your laurels.
34:36
and the success of yesterday good you archive them you move on to learn something bigger and different and that makes at least my life much more enjoyable than doing always the same thing because
34:49
To be frank with you, HR processes from hiring to retiring, they don't change too often. They can be streamlined, they can be tech driven, but the output is always the same. What is critical is how you get there, how from hiring a fresh graduate, you make him over time or make her over time an exec.
35:12
And that's where you can have your palette of skills that will help you to stretch talents, to move cross-functional talents from HR to finance, from finance to line management. And that's what I'm trying to instill to my team to think big, bold, no shortcuts.
35:33
Very few low hanging fruit.
35:36
HR has an impact over time. It cannot be tomorrow. And if you want to go with shortcuts, maybe you do something else. You do marketing, maybe, but maybe not HR.
35:47
Did I say something wrong? No, no, it's just funny. My team is telling me not good. You know why? Because you got the marketing team behind the camera in the room. We were upset now. Yes, that's why. I can see he's upset.
36:00
Fred, this sort of just came to mind. When you reflect on your long career at PMI, how long did you say? 20... 34. 34. Okay. I completely got that wrong. It's probably going to take a few seconds to think about, but what are you most proud of?
36:19
It will not be an assignment. I could mention Russia, where I stayed five years and a half. I think I did a bit of a good job or small food product that I sell from scratch. What I feel the most proud of, and this is certainly not me only talking, but that's the company culture.
36:42
My personal values have never gone against the company values.
36:47
If I stayed 34 years, it's because I feel at home here.
36:51
Though we are a public company, I feel at home. There is a sense of friendship, camaraderie.
37:00
We are very demanding when it comes to business deliverables. We are obsessed by what we will deliver tomorrow and the next 10 years.
37:07
But when I had a tough time and I had some
37:11
or difficult bosses or difficult assignments, I've never given up on my values because they were the company values.
37:21
And at time, it came with a toe on my shoulders where I had to fight back or to make my point against what management was thinking of.
37:32
I had a few bruises, but today I'm in front of you living and kicking with my butterflies like 34 years ago. You know, you call that passion, love.
37:42
And this is not only me talking. We are. That's the way we are operating this company. And, you know, I'll give you an anecdote back to my own values, not to the company values.
37:54
When when I took over as a smartphone product, we were hiring from scratch. We hired hundreds of people.
38:03
And in Lausanne, where that is the operating center of BMI, I had people coming in and telling me straight in my face, in particular Gen Z, I'm here three years, I build a line on my LinkedIn profile, I'll help you for transformation.
38:21
And ciao.
38:22
10 years after.
38:24
They're still here in the company. They're grown up, they are having senior roles. So there is there is a spirit, there is a soul, I call that the soul of PMI, that is the PMI DNA.
38:35
And people feel good. Now we have a low turnover, we are at 3% voluntary turnover.
38:41
We are still doing rack and stack when it comes to let go people to give space to the newcomers. But all of that is done with respect, with dignity, and it creates an ecosystem where we are performance driven, but not at any price. That's why I stayed so long in this company and I'm very proud of that. Yeah, I love that. I wanted to end with that because I kind of felt that throughout our whole conversation.
39:05
And you definitely wouldn't have been in the organization for that long if it wasn't connected to your purpose and your why, right? And I don't think it's a coincidence that now you've become the orchestrator of that within the organization.
39:21
So many years later, now you're the orchestrator of the culture. uh one of we are all part of it it's not one person's job um for sure my team is behind me exactly um the whole line managers are behind me i mean uh it's not a pnc show at the end it's the role of everyone i think every employee owns this and if you can do that and everyone owns it that's when you have real change um as well but listen i appreciate you coming on the show um and uh congrats to you and the team on the journey so far like you said it is a journey it doesn't end um as well but i wish you all the best until next week it was a pleasure
39:56
Thank you, Chris. And I hope to see you maybe one day in Lausanne if you come. Okay? 100%.
40:01
Take care. Thank you for your time. Cheers. Bye-bye.
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Frederic Patitucci, Chief People & Culture Officer at Philip Morris Internationa.