The Hidden Costs of Ignoring Workplace Wellbeing

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In this episode of the HR Leaders Podcast, I spoke with DJ Casto, EVP & Chief Human Resources Officer at Synchrony, about the hidden costs of deprioritising employee wellbeing - and the immense benefits of making it a strategic priority.

According to DJ's account, the feelings of seclusion and unease that numerous individuals encountered during the pandemic made his organization understand the necessity of providing equal support for mental well-being in addition to physical health. The accumulation of unaddressed stress has a multiplying effect and directly affects productivity. As a result, in collaboration with Thrive Global, they initiated the use of "60-second resets" which involve brief customised breathing techniques incorporated into their work routine to alleviate pressure.

The outcomes communicate loudly. Workers have an improved capacity to handle challenging circumstances with customers and regain energy for the subsequent call. They willingly chose these mini-pauses instead of 5-minute breaks, as they were concerned they might not fulfil their own expectations. This straightforward inclusion has been a great success.

DJ also emphasised the significance of vulnerability and trust in utilising mental health services. In addition to providing an anonymous hotline, they established in-house “wellbeing coaches” that workers can genuinely connect with. Ensuring a sense of safety and ease during delicate discussions is extremely important.

DJ emphasised that the objective of all this is to consistently listen, create new ideas, and offer employees the necessary assistance for their growth.

Want to learn how Synchrony is rethinking wellbeing and empowering employees? Tune in as DJ Casto shares actionable insights for HR leaders seeking healthier and more inclusive workplaces.

Episode Highlights:

How providing micro mental health breaks improves wellbeing and productivity
How building relatable wellbeing resources increases utilization and impact
How flexible parental leave policies boost retention and work-life quality

Recommended Resources

Connect with DJ on LinkedIn
Learn more about Synchrony

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🎙️ Automatically generated Podcast Transcript

DJ 0:00

One of the fascinating things we ask them would you want a five minute break or a 62nd reset, they've chosen the 62nd reset. Because the five minute break, they're afraid they won't actually be self disciplined enough to go through the exercise, and the exercise is really helping them to release that compounded stress.

Speaker 1 0:27

Hi, everyone, welcome back to the HR leaders podcast. In today's episode, I'm joined by DJ Casto, who's the Executive Vice President and Chief HR officer of synchrony. During the podcast DJ says how synchrony is prioritising wellbeing at work, shifting from traditional work models to a more inclusive and humanised work culture that prioritises wellbeing, growth and fulfilment. He also talks about the changing power dynamics at work within workplaces and the importance of making every employee voice a priority. As always, before we jumped into video, make sure you hit the subscribe button, turn on notification bell and a follow on your favourite podcast platform. But that being said, let's jump in. DJ, welcome to the show. How are you?

DJ 1:10

I'm great. Thanks for having me today.

Speaker 1 1:12

Nice to see you. I love the fact you're standing up super energised. You've clearly had your coffee already.

DJ 1:18

I did. I had my americano on ready to go but which often

Speaker 1 1:21

and tell everyone a little bit more about your background and journey to where we are today. Yeah,

DJ 1:28

so you know, I've been an HR leader for almost 20 years. First half was at PepsiCo. Great company to learn how to what I say do this work in a really purposeful way. And then join GE at the time that they were IPO and in separating this business, which became synchrony. I've had a really wonderful career experience to date with some great companies who truly know how to invest in people purposely the right way. And as we were talking about on the front end, I'm a proud father of three I've got but love it every day, I love being an HR leader, and love being a husband and father. I've

Speaker 1 2:11

never heard someone say dynamic. So you just want to say chaos.

DJ 2:16

We some days were thriving other days. On the moment,

Speaker 1 2:22

tell us a little bit more about the company, in case it's not worth it. So synchrony

DJ 2:25

is in consumer finance, right? So it's the largest private label credit card issuer in the US. We help strategically our partners provide a variety of financing options to the consumer. And so we have partners like Amazon and Venmo, and Pay Pal and Lowe's, Verizon, and so oftentimes, if you go in to to acquire kind of a payment solution, either kind of a buy now pay later or a credit card offering for promo financing, we are where the finance partner for them to provide those consumers kind of a variety of financing solutions. You know, we've had about 20,000 employees globally, you know, I think it's a special business that is really consumer focused on behalf of the partner to help finance, you know, just about everything you could imagine you need a couch, if you need some dental work that's outside your insurance, to just buying all those things we do and don't need, probably through our Amazon account. We're there. We're there to help.

Speaker 1 3:35

I know, one of the things from a cultural aspects of you really you're focused on is creating a culture of well being. Could you walk us through that? And then we can jump into some of the specifics of some of the actionable steps actionable steps you've taken?

DJ 3:46

Yeah, this is this is probably an area that honestly, I had to have some lived experiences to become a real champion around it. And I think, you know, we all it feels like a blur for many of us is we had to navigate that the unprecedented time of the pandemic. But I think what what one of the the positives that came out of that really tragic time was that we all got more in touch with who we are as human beings, as you as you figure out that there's things that are bigger than our than our jobs than some of these things we worry about every single day. And I And for me, I started to do a lot of active listening with our employees, I started to do a lot of active listening at home to my family, to my friends and and this concept of Total Wellness which before for me felt a little bit more like a marketing campaign. A we believe in investing in in your total self, your whole self, bring your whole self to work, but what does that really mean? And as we started to see employees be very vulnerable and us individually as leaders experience that, hey, we're all dealing with a lot. And there's this this intersection point between physical wellness and mental wellness. And we've done so much work around ensuring that our employees and ourselves take care of our physical wellness. And we almost were dismissive a bit around the the needs to invest in nurture our mental wellness. And, you know, if I would be honestly, I grew up in a household that you didn't really talk about the mental wellness components, it was all physical wellness, Dr. Strang, if you're strong, you'll be able to navigate all of it. And it was almost a wake up call for me during that period of time, that it's almost more ridiculous to dismiss it, than to think about all the infrastructure and support we put around physical wellness, but yet we shouldn't be taking care of and being very thoughtful around how we're supporting our mind, and how we can be the best human being to show up every day, and that your mind is this powerful component of who you are. And so we need to be thoughtfully investing in that the same way we have for decades invested

Speaker 1 6:15

in physical wellness, what were some of the ways that you know, realising that, you know, two thirds

DJ 6:20

of our workforce are what I'd say it's contact centre associates, they are they're doing a tonne of inbound calls from our consumers, trying to provide them solutions to make their customer experience better. We don't oftentimes get a lot of calls that just say, hey, everything's great, I actually just went to the to Lowe's, the checkout was seamless, I was able to get my promo for the refrigerator, I was trying to finance, Hey, I just made my 111 1,000th transaction on my Amazon cart, I just want you to tell you how much it is typically, than calling with something that they're needing help with. And, you know, for our for our agents, or associates, you know, that that's back to back calls of stressful moments. And, you know, as we were talking to them about a, we felt really good about providing them an option to work from home. You know, this was interesting, we were 99%. In office culture, prior to the pandemic, we were very traditional, we would debate for hours if a job could or could not work from home. And when we asked the question to our employees, would you want us to formalise a work from home solution or just come in which we thought was radical time come in three days a week 86% of our workforce, at that time said, we would love for you to formalise a work from home solution over 90% of our associates. Why do I give you that context is because they love it. They love being able to work from home, but it does make it more challenging and difficult. You don't have that colleague to your left or right to kind of take that break, have that human shoulder.

Speaker 1 8:08

Yeah, relate to you're both going through the same thing, challenges etc. Yeah,

DJ 8:14

your leader can't walk by and be like, Hey, are you good, as they, you know, maybe had to go take a tough call. So they don't, they're very cautious with me because they don't want us to revert Our philosophy here because they really appreciate the flexibility and choice. But we had to rethink radically well, how do you support that, because some of that stuff that happened organically as it relates to kind of wellness, and support can't happen at home. In fact, you get more isolation, and you get the pressures of home that are that are kind of merging with work. And so we looked for partners to help us with some of those solutions. And one of the great solutions that were presented to us through great places to work was thrive. That's been created by Arianna Huffington. And what I love that she's done, she's got science around this process of a of a 62nd reset. I don't know if you're familiar with this or not, but I

Speaker 1 9:11

am very familiar. I know. I know, around her personally, she also spoke at our wellbeing summit as good friend of ours. So I definitely know that

DJ 9:19

you know, not the 62nd reset, she probably did that at a moment when you guys were together. And I was a bit sceptical to begin with. I was like, What can 60 seconds really

Speaker 1 9:27

break down? break that down for everyone what that what that means, if you

DJ 9:31

if you keep playing out the example I gave with our associates, so think about that they're having back to back calls all day long. What we're working with our Ionic team on is to embed the 62nd reset in the workflow. And so if you had a long call, typically if the call is a certain length, it meant it was probably more complicated. There was probably more stress in that call and what Ariana is team has helped us to recognise is that If stress compounds over time, and so if our associates are taking back to back calls all day, and they're building up that stress, then their ability to provide that customer experience that we would want without having a reset, it's a low likelihood that they're going to be at their peak performance halfway through the day, versus when they started when they've had to take on that compounded stress. And so what happens is, with the Thrive reset, is, after a long call, we're able to route it and embed it in in the in the call flow to allow them 60 seconds to reset. And what is a reset, it's a breathing exercise. They're customizable. So for some folks, you can, if what's important to you, is seeing your family, like you know, on the soccer field or at a picnic or after a Halloween party, you know, at the end of the day, that picture could come up. And then it's correlated with some breathing exercises, maybe encouraging you to stand up, and then sit back down all of these things that are again, backed by science, that that breathing exercise, and that 62nd reset will allow you to release some of that compounded stress and allow you to complete your day a lot more effectively than than you used to without a resource like that. And we have we scaled it in all of Florida. So we've got 1000 person contact centre in Florida. We're working with them to make sure we fine tune when and how it gets embedded in the workflow. But but the feedback from our Associates has been tremendous. In fact, one of the fascinating things we asked them, would you want a five minute break? Or a 62nd? Reset? They've chosen the 62nd reset? Because the five minute break, they're afraid they won't actually be self disciplined enough to go through the exercise. And the exercise is really helping them to release that compounded stress.

Speaker 1 12:03

Yeah. Laughter What does it look like in their workflow? How's it embedded? They come up on their screen? What's that look like?

DJ 12:09

Yeah, so So you're so there's two different ways. So inter Diem is a tool that we use that kind of routes training, when people maybe need to be rescaled, or upskill. In a certain area, if we start to see a pattern, where some of the things that they're doing, they need to do a bit differently to be within our kind of standards. So we're using that same tool, where after the right now we're using the length of call, we'd love to start to use speech analytics and some other resources sentiment

Speaker 1 12:40

sentiment analysis, and you can kind of hear what's being said, and stuff like that, as

DJ 12:45

you think about the 2.0 this, but right now, one of probably the easiest indicators is length of call. So after they have a long call inter Diem routes to them, so they don't get their next call. Instead, what gets routed to them is this 62nd Reset that's in their workstation. And they actually go through the exercise after they go through the exercise, they come back online, to take their next call.

Chris Rainey 13:10

Yeah, what I love about that is a lot of sometimes with these well being or apps, etc, you have to go to them and search them out. Whereas this is really helping the employee in the flow of work in the moment that matters, if that makes sense. A lot of songs, yeah. As opposed to Okay, let me have a looking at in our intranet, what resources? Or do we have you're serving it when they need it in the flow of work and really having a huge impact on their employment, the employee experience, and obviously, of course, their well being 100%.

DJ 13:43

And unless, and that's why you got to find great partners, and I, you know, I want to give thrive, a lot of credit, you know, typically, to your point, people sell you things, and it's like, well, this is the way it is you can use it or not. But we've started to embed this principle around co designing with our employees, some of our best benefit offerings that we've provided, have not been fully the thought has been completed. But the actual implementation of it isn't fully baked yet. So we actually launch it through that Agile methodology of kind of a minimal viable product and say, hey, help us kind of CO design on what's the most important thing for you. And that's what we're doing with thrive with, with with our associates before we scale it across the board. Where did the friction points what worked? Well, what didn't work? Well? Is there a is there a threshold? We think it's 10 minutes, maybe it's five minutes? Let's go talk to our associates. If we did a five minute intervention point where we give you you know, that 60 seconds do we feel like that is better or until a lot of this testing and learning is helping us to get it right because this isn't about a check the box right? I'm not going to feel better now that I've asked For a new Wellness Benefit, I'm going to feel better when I hear from the voice of my employees that, hey, that really made a difference. But would you consider doing X versus Y, and that CO designing principle has helped us a tonne to get to a better end state or a better product designs things to allow the employee to be their best. And for us to drive peak performance, right, because there's that full circle kind of component to this on why I'm investing in it. It's a part of my values, but it's also going to help us drive peak performance for the for the company. Yeah,

Speaker 1 15:32

it's also good for business. As well have you also like integrated it into the flow of work of like, into things like teams or slack and stuff like that. So it shows that it's fully

DJ 15:42

embedded into teams, which is a really nice benefit for my, if you think about my people, leaders, that aren't having kind of their day scheduled for them. So I've been using it personally, what I like about it is two things. One, you can schedule, your 62nd resets in your Outlook calendar. So I can look at my schedule. And I can say, Man, I am jam today. And those are going to be some pretty intense meetings or meetings that are going to take a lot of energy, you know, I'm going to add to my calendar through Thrive into Outlook, a 62nd reset. So because you know, we all try to prioritise these things, but then your day takes over. It's like, Man, I should have done that at 12 o'clock. And so by scheduling it, it happens. The other thing that it does, by having it embedded within teams is it will, it will prompt a series of questions. How are you feeling today? You know, and you think as a as a leader, it's like, why don't have time for that. But if you just click on it, and then again, it takes maybe 30 seconds, it starts to ask you a series of questions, and then prompts an exercise, right? Hey, you might want to take take a moment, right, based off of how you answered those questions. So what I like about it is it's kind of like an ala carte menu of offerings, right? You can do it through teens, you can decide when you want it on your on your Outlook calendar, it will prompt you now you have to decide if you're going to answer the question or not. Or we can embed it in your workflow. And I think we've got to have those customizable options because our workforce is not monolithic. There's there's a there's very, there's a lot of diversity in the roles and how that how that day works for that leader, and I've got to have solutions that that meet the diversity of those roles.

Speaker 1 17:36

Talking about diversity. Yeah, I know, You've created a diverse set of wellbeing coaches, if I remember you saying, yeah.

DJ 17:45

So this is this is a great example of CO designing with our employees. So at at a time where I feel like, you know, it's just constant, that there is a lot going on in the world, right? And what is going on in the world is directly impacting our workforce. And so we always had resources like EAP. And I think there's a place for that. But it is a it is a very, it feels very a very corporate driven benefit, you have to call kind of this one 800 Number, you don't know the individual on the on the other side of the phone, do I really want to be that vulnerable, yeah, start to unpack what's going on in my life. And I don't know anything about those individuals now, to meet the needs of our workforce. It's a benefit that we need to have out there. And a lot of our employees use it, and they're fine with it. But one of the things we heard, particularly from our diverse workforce is DJ, I love to have a wellness coach, that that that I can identify with. Yeah. And so like my black experiences network, came to us and said, Could we have a wellness coach to help lead some of our wellness conversations that also has had lived black experiences. Same thing with my female network, or women's network, as we call it, our, you know, advancing Hispanic talent initiatives. And so we've tried to look at the diversity of our workforce and create a roster of coaches that actually match the diversity of our own lovers. And what and they're dedicated to us because the other thing is people want to build trust to be able to go there on these topics. People want to know who they are, what they're about their background, their experiences. And so we publish their photos, their bios, amazing. Employees can just set up one on one meetings with them through Outlook, or they can invite them to team meetings or they can be invited to diversity network meetings, and they've really become a part of kind of our culture and DNA. If we have an event that's happening we typically the first step is let's go to our world. As coaches, the roster was who who's the right person at this moment that could speak to our workforce the best. And they normally Co Co lead discussions with us, and help us to navigate all the things that continue to come to us, within the workforce. So it's been a really powerful addition to the company. And I only want to call it a benefit. They've just been a great addition. They're like a team that we lean on, and our leaders lean on to help better support our workforce. Yeah.

Speaker 1 20:38

How did you? So are these people that work full time? Or are they part of a aid provider that you work with? Like, how does that work? Or is it and if you're already work, they're taking this on as additional work? Like, how's that work?

DJ 20:53

Yeah, we were deliberate. You know, I want to ensure these individuals are trained professionals, because what could happen is, and they're not, they are not a, they are not designed to take on kind of a full time engagement with an employee, I think of them as almost like a broker where we might have 10 conversations together. And then we'll decide, you know, what, here's what you really need, you really need to leverage one of our financial wellness coaches, because we've had eight conversations about your finances, and I'm here to listen to you. But we've got to start to put together an action plan so that we can move to action to help support you the right way. If it's if it's a true mental wellness issue there, they might need someone who's a dedicated therapist and trained therapists. So someone

Speaker 1 21:49

I would start a conversation with, that you can relate to that you can see yourself in this present.

DJ 21:55

And what you're trying to do is is is build trust and confidence in the ecosystem, that you know what if I do have this, this concern, I'll go to them, we deliberately designed it where they're not our employees, so that there is a bit of a wall where it is an agency that we use, oh, so they're definitely 100% dedicated to us. But but there's also the ability for there to be a bit of a separation, so that our employees can leverage them. They can broker the resources and feel comfortable on doing that. But it's not a it's not a direct member of my team.

Chris Rainey 22:32

That's important, right? Because they might not want to go, they're like, Oh, what if they tell me am I going to be you know, am I going to be seen as less valuable? And I'll be over overlooked for a promotion? Because I'm having these challenges. No, like, you know, they want to feel like they're going to someone separate, impartial. Right. From Yeah,

DJ 22:46

I think I always try to I would hope that people wouldn't feel it hope so. Yeah. But, but I also get human feeling and nature and, and caution as you navigate really sensitive topics. And it might not even be a correlation to career or success. But it just might be I don't want to share those things. I don't want people to know all of those things about me. Yeah, but I do need help. And that's their story. That's their, that's their hurt personal things that they have to navigate. And back to what are we trying to solve for? I'm not trying to solve where I feel better that I've stood up a team, what I want to feel better on is that my employees are using these resources to help them be their best. And at the end of the day, if I design it in a vacuum, and don't think thoughtfully around some of the things you and I just talked about, Chris, then I won't get the usage that I'm looking for. And the usage is again, not a metric, the usage is is an indicator that my employees need this. And so how do I provide more opportunities for them to engage in with a resource that can really help them? Yeah.

Chris Rainey 23:59

And also you want to really remove removed, focus on being proactive rather than reactive, right? Because a lot of times a lot of these solutions is not addressing it's like putting a bandaid on the problem. You're not really addressing the real issue as well. So that's super important. Yeah,

DJ 24:19

well, oftentimes you need a variety of our solutions collectively together, yes, to really meet your need. But where do you start? And I feel like oftentimes employees struggle with just starting somewhere it's the biggest

Speaker 1 24:32

part. Yeah, is the stigma stigma attached is quite overwhelming. You know, even for me when I first saw someone because I was suffering for bank anxiety and was super embarrassed, like the thought of physically going and travelling to see someone in person to talk about my anxiety was really overwhelming. And I was like, Oh, I don't know. But then I ended up having a zoom call with a therapist. And that was, it wasn't zoom. It was a video call with a company and I was like I suppose a lot less invasive. And it's not, it's not someone in the company, someone impartial, they're not going to judge me. And this is a great experience to do that. So the easier you can make it and the fact that you are then talking to someone that looks like you has the same list of experiences, you're going to feel so much more comfortable having that conversation. What What about because you mentioned, obviously, you're, you're a dad of, you know, father of three kids now, how has that made you reflect on on the work you do, and what you offer around sort of parental leave, and stuff like that? Because there's one thing hearing about it before you're a parent you think you understand? And then you become a parent, and then you realise, oh, wow, okay. It's very different. It's,

DJ 25:46

it's probably one of the most powerful, to your point, live, expect lived experiences. Yeah, that changed who I am, both personally and professionally, for the better, right, I think it gave me perspective, a level of humility around what it what it takes to be able to navigate both worlds. And I think we, for certain chapter of my life with my wife, our primary focus was us, you know, making sure that we had a strong relationship, and then our careers. And, you know, although that takes work, you then add a layer of being personally responsible for a human being that you've created. It's, it's probably one of the most powerful moments that if you're, that you're blessed to have. And so, for me, the first probably, eye opening moment was watching my wife navigate it, which is where I became really passionate around the leave we're offering and how we offer that leave. Because it was really important for her, as she was contemplating whether to continue her professional career. Or Or think about dedicating this chapter to just being, not just being but being one of the most important roles a mother believed that her company designed, provided this optionality. And what I mean by that is, it's not just the length of time, but it's how you take that time. And, and a lot of this has to be between the family unit at home, right. And so what I, what I, what I witnessed with her was the amount of time they provided, which candidly, was more than what we were providing the time, which was a wake up call one, and then to the ability to take it intermittently. And so you can take a portion of it, but then save a portion of it to, to leverage for moments that matter. Those moments of matter might be first doctor's appointments, or first days of going to a class together to share that experience between kind of child and parent. And so I came back initially and said, We've got to rethink this and redesign it. And I did some active listening, which I've done before. But when you do active listening with a shared experience, you're better at asking the questions that really matter. One of the things we changed was, it was a horrific experience for our birthing mothers to have to go out on short term disability. Which, by the way, when you say that out loud,

Speaker 1 28:44

sounds crazy. Yeah, sounds sounds horrific. Yeah. On a short term

DJ 28:49

disability, to bring life into the world, which just think that for a moment, and it was a clunky experience that added stress on top of an already really stressful time. And so we said, get rid of that. And this is the really neat thing about being in the role that I'm in with a with a terrific leader of total rewards is we have the remit to change those things. And sometimes it's just like, well, that's the way it is. Nope, doesn't have to be let's let's really think about how do we make that employee experience at a time when it when their life is profoundly changing? Make it better. So we came back we got it in take, we took it out of short term disability, we made it a more seamless process for for the birthing parent to go through. We extended the weeks we now offer up to 22 weeks of parental leave. And then and then the other reflection moment I had was how am I showing up? How am I helping Leah to navigate this this moment and how do I get to participate in this moment and not feel guilty? for doing so it will tell you, I got better. It took three children. Right? This is the session where we're allowed to be a little honest with each other. Right. So I didn't take as much time for Lilyana. My first, but I did take a lot of dedicated time for parentally, with Nikko, who was my third because it was, I learned a lot through each one of those moments. And I also understood the perspective as those are things you never get back. And if my company believes in me, and they trusted me, when I show up after after being present, at that moment that really mattered for my family, I'm actually going to be a better leader, post that versus the guilt that I'm feeling that I didn't show up and take dedicated time. But I didn't do it at for a long period of time at the birth of Nico actually took it in the summer, where I can share it with all three of my children and my wife, we she took that leave at the at the same time. So we actually had like a really beautiful time together, where we took our family to Italy, and celebrated my son's baptism at the home at the town in which my grandparents were originally from before they immigrated to the United States. And so it was one of these experiences that my wife and I talked about, and tried to figure out when was the moment that we feel like we were going to, we were going to do something collectively together the family that we will always remember and also allow me to be more present with my family. So that intermittent component of when you take it, I think is just as powerful as how much time you give those individuals.

Chris Rainey 31:45

Yeah, firstly, I love that, as you said, those are the moments that you will never forget. And you will also never forget that that was the organisation that supported you know, right. And that's where people really go above and beyond without being asked to do so. Because they really, you know, value to the time that they had in the company that supported them when in the times that life changing to your point. One thing I'd add today is also the importance of supporting parents when they return. Yes to the workplace, which is my wife didn't have the greatest of experience, I remember, she was so overwhelmed and stressed and like as the days went by, the count down towards the day. And there was zero communication or support from the organisation beforehand. And she had no idea what what she was walking back into. It was a new team was a new manager, you know, all of those things, right? She's still breastfeeding at the time. She's called Managing, you know, Robin love nursery, and there was zero communication. And I was like, This is crazy, that like you should not be you should be excited. She should be, you know, really looking forward to it when she and she was originally and then as as the time went by, towards the turning, she came more and more stressed. And I was like, What a terrible, what a moment that the company has missed what a missed opportunity to really, you know, help her along the way? How are you looking at that?

DJ 33:08

Yeah, I mean, I think honestly, you bring up an excellent, this is where all companies could lean in a bit more to think about, it's not even just day one, although day one is very stressful. Particularly if you have to make a choice to put your child in daycare, and you've been able to be there like these are, these are really stressful moments in a parent's life. And so I think that the one thing we are doing right now, we're doing some work on return ships, and through return ships, and this isn't just coming back from parental leave. But if you've taken a moment to actually, you know, carve out some dedicated time with your family, how do we encourage more returnships So we have a returnship programme that we've started and through that returnship programme, we're actually learning a lot. And we're learning a lot about all of the stress points or friction points that typically exist and are still a disproportionate burden for typically the the birthing mother, then then the Father as you think about the dualities of roles and I'm not that every household is different. And every household divvies up those responsibilities different but I would say in my household, even though I tried to show up, there are a lot of moments that are my children want their mother and their mother has a bit more complexity and kind of navigating and so I think we need to recognise that it could be the father versus the mother or you know, two partners that are that are deciding to do this collectively together. So I don't I don't I don't want to profile one for the other but but typically in the household. One individual show is experienced a bit more I think about my contact centres where I have you know, over 70% are female, many are single mothers And I think about that stress when you think about the complexity of not actually having someone to help you navigate it the right way. So one thing we did there is childcare and emergency childcare. You know, this is probably the one of the biggest stress points, you think you have it all plans. Yeah, I

Unknown Speaker 35:19

know it. Trust me,

DJ 35:20

I think all right, you've had it, you get the dreaded call, which is like, your childcare solution has fallen through

Chris Rainey 35:26

my wife, my daughter's nursery closed down. And there was nothing in the area, every nursery was fully booked. It was a nightmare. So ya know, yeah,

DJ 35:38

here's what we did. Because we experienced that too, you know, we did, we just said, again, this is where if you're agile, and you trust your workforce, and you don't get so caught up in legacy processes, we just said, you know, what, we will give you up to $100 a day, you can find whoever can take care of your child, it can be a neighbour, it could be a mother, it could be a friend, we will reimburse you up to that $100 a day, it does not have to be, you know, a certified child care facility, we had made all this engineering that had really limited the amount of folks that people could tap into. And listen, I grew up with a working mother, who took care of me, my grandmother and my two great aunts, right, that kind of helped do that. If they if they could, on a whim, be able to flex for my mom, why couldn't I give them that $100 reimbursement just like I would give a corporate entity. It's

Speaker 1 36:32

crazy. Cuz you say out loud, right. And when you spoke to your, your benefits manager, it was probably like, oh, just because the way we do it, like, there's no real reason why you're doing it that way. It's just because that's how we do it. So I love that, you know, it's sometimes it's, you know, we were putting all these barriers and stress points in place for no reason whatsoever.

DJ 36:53

Well, as HR teams, I will tell you, and I've got, I have an amazing total rewards team that has really embraced this methodology. But you know, we talk about agile methodology in the business to drive better product innovation, our benefits are products. Sure, yeah. We should be using that same design thinking, and that same agile mindset. But that's that was radical for my teams. Would you talk about a standardised, standardised offering? Hey, we do this once a year through open enrollment? No, we do this quarterly in rethinking our benefits providing the needs now your core medical benefits. I can't change insurance that frequently but the support benefits that I provide, why can't I be more agile? Why can I be more innovative? Why can I think we're too conservative? And this? Why can't I test the benefit? Extreme coming? Well, you'll never be able to go to the workforce and take it away? Yeah. Could you know why? I just would be honest, we thought it was going to do X. It's not it's doing why we did some listening sessions, I'm going to pivot those resources to offer this versus that. You know, I'm not saying I wouldn't have some people that won't be pleased on that change. But we're looking to help the majority of our workforce,

Chris Rainey 38:08

people understand that, right? Like, you're just talking to them like normal human beings and saying, Hey, we actually decided to didn't work, but which and the fact that you communicate this way companies go wrong is that they do various things you're describing, but they don't give the feedback of the why? I think so they'll take it away. Or they'll add something or they'll do a survey, and they'll get you know, 90% of people replying and don't even follow up with the feedback. Okay, we hate you. We tried this, but we decided to do that. Okay, great. Thank you for letting me know, like, at least appreciate you taking the time to come on the show before I let you go. You're obviously still on this journey. Right? It never ends.

Speaker 1 38:45

What advice would you give to our listeners as they think about mental health and well being? And then also, where can they connect with you if they want to reach out to you personally and say hi.

DJ 38:54

Yeah, so So what I would say is, I think what we're striving here is, is for continual innovation, constant, active listening, giving ourselves grace when something goes wrong, because I think sometimes we're too cautious and too conservative, particularly when you're thinking about benefit offerings or, or how you're supporting things. And I think if you back to your point, Chris, we're just honest with your workforce, that we're going to test and learn a lot of things. And then we're going to, we're going to invest to do those things at scale that helped the majority of the workforce. And our benefits are designed as an ala carte menu. So there are certain things that this year you might eat into a bit more intentionally. And the next year, you might not need them, but your colleagues might. And so at the end of the day, we're just trying to be better at providing the best solutions possible to help the diversity of our workforce. And if you stay anchored to that, I think you're going to come up with really interesting solutions that help your employees be their best to drive peak performance. And then I would say the easiest way to connect with me, it's just LinkedIn. I'm on there. It's an easy way to kind of connect if we've got anything we can do to help someone else who's thinking through some of this. And if you've got great ideas that could help me, I'm not looking to open the floodgates to every vendor that's out there. partners who can help you think about applying the work.

Speaker 1 40:27

Discussion, amazing, and I'm sure there's not that many DJ Casso on LinkedIn so they can put your

DJ 40:33

music superstar he talked about that you can google randomly. Yeah, well,

Speaker 1 40:39

and anyone listening as always, all those links will be below to connect with DJ. I'll also put a link in to some of the resources that you mentioned and companies as well. But honestly, thanks so much for coming on the show. I love what you're doing genuinely. And I wish you all the best until next week. Thanks so much.